tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post82813906600229038..comments2023-06-28T05:21:02.505-05:00Comments on Conservative Economics: Why Capitalism is the Best Economics SystemMatthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comBlogger45125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-78830881696449928232012-01-25T07:10:43.703-06:002012-01-25T07:10:43.703-06:00You would think after the Great Depression, the 19...You would think after the Great Depression, the 1970s, and the current economic malaise that Keynesian economic prescription would be dead. In mainstream economics post-1970s, it essentially is dead. However, I do have some comments for some common fallacies in message:<br /><br />1. Capitalism sends wealth to those (entrepreneurs) who provide the most value to society. <br /><br />2. Every economy leaves those groups behind. That is why charity is necessary. The question is whether this charity will be voluntary (non-violent) or involuntary (violent). It's obvious what Keynesian's prescribe.<br /><br />3. You're right about <i>one</i> thing - no system is perfect.<br /><br />4. Economies are dynamic, therefore, activity always drifts up and down as the players adjust to circumstances. Government intervention makes these corrections more often and severe. Keynesian economics prolonged what could have been a simple recession to one of the greatest depressions. It wasn't until after they slashed government spending post-1945 that we had a recovery. That's precisely the opposite of what Keynesians would have predicted. <br /><br />5. Corporatism isn't possible without regulation. Regulation is the lifeblood of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_entrepreneur" rel="nofollow">political entrepreneurs.</a> They simply cannot compete without government intervention.<br /><br />6. The only poor countries with more capitalist characteristics are those that suffered through despotic regimes that ultimately collapsed. They're undeniably better off without them (apples to apples) and may even greatly develop if the coup d'état doesn't assume political control of the country. <br /><br />However, history teaches us that any country who develops wealth produces a political class that seeks to protect that wealth. That's where subsidies, protectionism, government contracts, and other such favorable arrangements with government have their genesis. <br /><br />Only capitalism or free markets can provide the original economic growth to allow for such a class of people and economic way of thinking. <br /><br />Prior to capitalism the same type of people acquired wealth from looting, plundering and enslaving their fellow man.<br /><br />7. Keynesian economics didn't create developed nations. It attaches itself to them and slowly destroys them like a parasite. <br /><br />Keynes once said "Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist." Ironically, he literally became that archetype.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-70564990700803292752012-01-24T23:53:47.226-06:002012-01-24T23:53:47.226-06:00Capitalism sends wealth up the socioeconomic trian...Capitalism sends wealth up the socioeconomic triangle. Capitalism leaves behind the disabled, the elderly, the sick, the homeless, the theoretical scientists, and the students. <br /><br /> These are just a few of the reasons why pure capitalism doesn't work. The truth is that no one system is perfect and therefore we must combine the best aspects of multiple systems - Keynesian Economics. <br /><br /> In capitalism, there is a boom and bust cycle. Government must spend and attempt to subsidize or even nationalize industries during busts or else capitalism will fall, as America nearly did in the 1930s.<br /><br /> Absolute capitalism without regulation ends up as corporatism, just as absolute communism without reform ends up as a bureaucratic nightmare. Keynesian mixed economics is the system adopted by most developed countries (those that are not Communist) and pure capitalism exists only in the poorest nations of the world that have no government.<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keynesian_economics#Postwar_KeynesianismAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-44998931130405750662010-10-01T17:23:49.069-05:002010-10-01T17:23:49.069-05:00Great.Great.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-85029951235755092042010-10-01T15:30:42.671-05:002010-10-01T15:30:42.671-05:00Matt, I just saw that you posted my economic plan ...Matt, I just saw that you posted my economic plan in the mises forum. I posted a bunch of responses there.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-87458513054110403472010-08-08T20:49:06.746-05:002010-08-08T20:49:06.746-05:00If you are interested in what people like me had t...If you are interested in what people like me had to say about the "plan," you can check out this thread:<br /><a href="http://mises.org/Community/forums/p/18607/351631.aspx#351631" rel="nofollow">Economic Utopian Plan</a>Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-89966966870693349802010-07-29T14:06:34.402-05:002010-07-29T14:06:34.402-05:00You may email the plan to mattherb182 (at) yahoo ....You may email the plan to mattherb182 (at) yahoo . comMatthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-19948505703841135412010-07-29T13:21:34.427-05:002010-07-29T13:21:34.427-05:00This is a limited way to explain a complex idea. H...This is a limited way to explain a complex idea. How can I email you the plan?<br /><br />Not only does it show how paying a dividend is the most humane use of our tax money (and the only way to have the economic policy to pursue full automation instead of full employment), it also shows how to have a credit system where you get access to any loan you want without having to pay interest (which eliminates trillions in wasted expense every year and eliminates the number one expense in your life because commercial banking became obsolete with the invention of the connected computer) and how the power of choice, which enables you to wield full control over the economy and forces it to cater to your individual wants and needs, should be extended so that you also have the power to choose between economic models which will enable you to earn up to $365k per year in whatever job you do.<br /><br />But to answer your question, the economic plan is based on a national income of $18 trillion which we will reach in about 4 years (if implemented today, it would be 20% less). And it calls for a more fair tax by making the 35% income tax and 15% FICA tax a flat tax that everyone pays on 100% of your income without deductions. That will raise $9 trillion in tax revenue which is enough revenue to pay all 220 million adults a $20,000 yearly Basic Income and all 150 million workers a $30,000 yearly Worker Bonus.<br /><br />The federal government, once you eliminate social security, medicaid and medicare, can be paid for with a 4% tax.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-44119850028071409272010-07-29T09:28:44.918-05:002010-07-29T09:28:44.918-05:00Just out of curiosity, did you consider how much i...Just out of curiosity, did you consider how much it would cost to provide a $20,000 base salary for 307,006,550 U.S. citizens?<br /><br />$6,140,131,000,000<br /><br />Total tax revenues in 2009 was $2,105,000,000,000<br /><br />There is a small discrepancy there mate. Not only do you have to cut all current federal spending (defense, medicare, etc.) to meet a third of the base salary, but you have to raise an additional $4,035,131,000,000 in tax revenue to meet the bill.<br /><br />You should really do some more thinking.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-40131925514207982222010-07-27T16:57:56.206-05:002010-07-27T16:57:56.206-05:00What a nice sounding Utopian paradise. If you want...What a nice sounding Utopian paradise. If you want to learn what libertarianism is, you can read a <a href="http://mises.org/rothbard/newlibertywhole.asp" rel="nofollow">real manifesto here</a>. <br /><br /><b>"Our productivity comes from automation. Being able to produce more goods and services using less labor is how we increase our wealth. Increasing automation and eliminating jobs is what makes us wealthy.<br /><br />And automation improves our quality of life. It frees us from having to spend our limited time doing tasks nobody has any interest in doing."</b><br /><br />It is more than just automation, but yes, in a nutshell, this is the purpose and function of capitalism. You should definitely read the introduction book to economics along with a real libertarian manifesto. Then you might avoid using a straw man argument. You have a ways to go before understanding capitalism and libertarianism, but a willing mind can learn much.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-56954054971824568642010-07-27T14:32:14.891-05:002010-07-27T14:32:14.891-05:00That book is not an economics education, it is a l...That book is not an economics education, it is a libertarian manifesto. Libertarianism is a backwards philosophy whose goal is to bring society back to the 1700s.<br /><br />That is where we differ. You want to re-live the 18th century, I want to build a society where everyone is wealthy, technology liberates us from jobs and the world is a paradise. And all of that is feasible today BY JUST SIMPLY CHANGING HOW WE SPEND OUR EXISTING TAXES.<br /><br />It should be used to pay every adult a $20k per year guaranteed basic income. It gets paid to everyone, rich and poor, employed and unemployed. And then pay every worker a $30k per year worker bonus on top of whatever salary they earn.<br /><br />That ends poverty and puts an end to every government welfare program including social security, medicaid and medicare. <br /><br />It will give you far greater freedom in lifestyle choices than any libertarian society would. And it would make sure EVERY worker earned a six-figure, upper-class income, and enjoys access to the good life, something only 7% of the population gets to enjoy today.<br /><br />This will enable us to abandon the backwards, caveman economic policy of pursuing full employment and instead replace it with the policy of pursuing full automation.<br /><br />We should put an end to the job. The only work a human being should do is the kind of work they would be doing if they didn't have a job to go to.<br /><br />Our productivity comes from automation. Being able to produce more goods and services using less labor is how we increase our wealth. Increasing automation and eliminating jobs is what makes us wealthy.<br /><br />And automation improves our quality of life. It frees us from having to spend our limited time doing tasks nobody has any interest in doing.<br /><br />The fact that most of us spend the vast majority of our brief moment in time in this universe working a job is a tragedy. We should use automation to eliminate every job that exists that people only do because they are getting paid to do it.<br /><br />Work should be a source of growth and well-being, not a chore.<br /><br />People should spend their time being productive in something that inspires them to live, not working some job like a piece of machinery.<br /><br />And this is not some star trek techno-utopia. This is possible today.<br /><br />100% of our physical wealth comes from just 35 million jobs in mining, utilities, manufacturing, construction, maintenance, and healthcare. That's just 1/5th of the workforce. We can switch to working just 1 day per week without any reduction in our standard of living. Put another way, 80% of the workforce could quit their jobs without any reduction in our standard of living.<br /><br />The other 115 million jobs can be automated with existing technology (banking, transportation), are obsolete (retail trade) or are things people volunteer for (music, fire, police, education).<br /><br />Hopefully you still have an open mind and are able to consider whether this forward thinking idea serves you and the rest of humanity better than the backwards thinking libertarianism does.<br /><br />It will make you wealthier, it will reduce government and it will give you greater freedom than libertarianism will. Libertarianism is only concerned with negative freedoms. This will secure both your negative and positive freedoms.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-61025069792369413252010-07-27T10:12:44.138-05:002010-07-27T10:12:44.138-05:00After you have read Hazlitt's Economic in One ...After you have read Hazlitt's <i>Economic in One Lesson</i>, you can move onto something more advanced such as his <a href="http://mises.org/daily/2406" rel="nofollow"><i>Man vs. The Welfare State</i></a> which addresses the negative income tax proposal.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-64532369068836585262010-07-27T07:16:53.253-05:002010-07-27T07:16:53.253-05:00Now, who is really buying into propaganda? I recom...Now, who is really buying into propaganda? I recommend picking up a book called <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FEconomics-One-Lesson-Shortest-Understand%2Fdp%2F0517548232%3Fie%3DUTF8%26s%3Dbooks%26qid%3D1280232814%26sr%3D8-1&tag=yogahabits-20&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325" rel="nofollow">Economics in One Lesson</a> by Henry Hazlitt. It is a great book for people struggling to understand the basics.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-33608840108037186952010-07-27T03:37:13.324-05:002010-07-27T03:37:13.324-05:00matt, a basic income is not the same as a minimum ...matt, a basic income is not the same as a minimum wage! It does not interfere with the pricing of labor, so it wouldn't make it more difficult for low skilled workers or anyone else to find a job like your article tried to suggest.<br /><br />And your claim that less government will makes us more wealthy is just as inaccurate. Eliminating government and all its programs will increase income disparity, increase uninsured, increase homelessness, decrease home ownership, decrease the amount of people who get educated.<br /><br />Since 1975, practically all the gains in household income have gone to the top 20% of households, not surprisingly with reagan's dismantling of every program that doesn't help the rich.<br /><br />I know Lew Rockwell didn't pass along the memo to you, but people in countries with more government intervention have a higher standard of living like Norway, Australia, Iceland, Canada, Ireland, Netherlands, Sweden, France, Switzerland, Luxembourg, Japan, Finland.<br /><br />And if you just look at economic life, even the people in the Arab Emirates and Kuwait live wealthier lives. The average town in the US looks like a ghetto compared to how they live in Dubai.<br /><br />The market should be used as a tool to serve us. We do not serve the market. Preventing people from setting up programs to make up for the things the market cannot accomplish (like a basic income for universal wealth, universal healthcare, universal education and universal home ownership) is not going to make society better. It will make it worse.<br /><br />The people telling you we cannot implement programs in addition to a market to create a society that achieves our goals are con artists.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-20194335625210119292010-07-26T18:47:39.549-05:002010-07-26T18:47:39.549-05:00It is simple economics. The only way to maximum we...It is simple economics. The only way to maximum wealth is to have an economy that is as free of government intervention as possible. Your scheme would not work for the exact same reasons <a href="http://www.forbes.com/2009/10/16/minimum-wage-labor-economics-opinions-contributors-art-carden.html" rel="nofollow">minimum wage doesn't help the poor</a>. If you win the lottery, you will most definitely be richer than you were before. If everyone wins the lottery, then nobody will be richer. <br /><br />In <i>The Fatal Conceit</i>, F.A. Hayek said that "[t]he curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-38130591554116593882010-07-26T13:10:49.516-05:002010-07-26T13:10:49.516-05:00Matt, so somehow when some rich guy who got his mo...Matt, so somehow when some rich guy who got his money by winning the genetic lottery and being born into a rich family, as an example, spends his money, the economy works just fine.<br /><br />But when some other guy who got his money from a tax dividend spends his money, the economy somehow cannot produce for him!<br /><br />We already have a healthy economy. And it produces enough to give 100% of the population a wealthy lifestyle if income was more evenly distributed.<br /><br />I can assure you when you spend your tax dividend, the business is not going to ask where you got that money from before he sells you whatever you wanna buy.<br /><br />And if redistribution of income changes the makeup of what we produce so that there is increased demand for 5000 sq ft homes instead of 15000 sq ft homes, tvs instead of antique furniture and mercedes instead of private jets, the economy will adjust without a glitch.<br /><br />It is surprising how these "think tanks" have got some people so brainwashed that they actually think that getting a check from the government will not increase their wealth and that spending that money somehow won't work. But like PT Barnum said...<br /><br />I looked at that article you gave. At what point do you recognize that the goal of libertarianism is not to have an economy that produces maximum wealth for all but rather to have an economy that is as free of government intervention as possible?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-44197501820279069032010-07-26T11:29:00.997-05:002010-07-26T11:29:00.997-05:00Anon ~ Now I see what you are saying. No it wouldn...Anon ~ Now I see what you are saying. No it wouldn't make us 100% wealthy to pay everyone a dividend from tax revenues. A healthy, sound economy isn't caused by higher wages and consumer spending. Higher wages and consumer spending is a result of a healthy, sound economy. The cart doesn't come before the horse. If production doesn't improve either by innovation or efficiency, no scheme will do anything to change it. Perhaps, you should study economics instead of calling it propaganda. You could start with <a href="http://www.econlib.org/library/Columns/y2008/Jasaychurning.html" rel="nofollow">The Library of Economics and Liberty</a>.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-21938163620572979852010-07-26T10:05:29.835-05:002010-07-26T10:05:29.835-05:00Matt, you think if we used existing tax revenue to...Matt, you think if we used existing tax revenue to pay everyone a dividend so people can live a better life that it would turn us into a poor, unindustrialized, third world nation like China and the Soviet Union used to be where we have no human rights, no property, no individualism, and the govt nationalizes every business!?!<br /><br />I think your analysis is a little off. Maybe it is time to take a break from the Mises propaganda?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-35668537905158334172010-07-26T08:44:09.083-05:002010-07-26T08:44:09.083-05:00Anon ~ Your egalitarian scheme has been tried many...Anon ~ Your egalitarian scheme has been tried many times in history already. Before you start cheer leading Marx, you should study the communist societies such as the Soviet Union or China to see if they eliminated poverty. In reality, they have either collapsed or been forced to make market reforms such as China just to survive. Not one communist society ever sustained any lasting economic growth. Not to mention that some of the world's greatest atrocities and mass murders have come at the hands of communist regimes.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-80812813792526294992010-07-26T08:37:24.924-05:002010-07-26T08:37:24.924-05:00Stew ~ You are right to a certain extent. Once the...Stew ~ You are right to a certain extent. Once the wheels of socialism and plunder begin to turn, everyone wants to join in the living at the expense of others. Frederic Bastiat said,<br /><br />"Self-preservation and self-development are common aspirations among all people. And if everyone enjoyed the unrestricted use of his faculties and the free disposition of the fruits of his labor, social progress would be ceaseless, uninterrupted, and unfailing.<br /><br />But there is also another tendency that is common among people. When they can, they wish to live and prosper at the expense of others. This is no rash accusation. Nor does it come from a gloomy and uncharitable spirit. The annals of history bear witness to the truth of it: the incessant wars, mass migrations, religious persecutions, universal slavery, dishonesty in commerce, and monopolies. This fatal desire has its origin in the very nature of man — in that primitive, universal, and insuppressible instinct that impels him to satisfy his desires with the least possible pain."<br /><br />Human nature is not the fault of Capitalism. Implementing Communism or any other economic system will not change human nature. In fact, those other systems foster the increase of plundering.<br /><br />Frederic Bastiat's ideas deserve a serious hearing in his famous <a href="http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html#SECTION_G713" rel="nofollow">The Law</a>.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-4824110337088469692010-07-26T05:40:16.297-05:002010-07-26T05:40:16.297-05:00Yes, using existing taxes to pay everyone a $20k b...Yes, using existing taxes to pay everyone a $20k basic income and every worker another $30k would make everyone wealthy, end poverty, end financial struggle, and improve our quality of life.<br /><br />If that somehow makes me a communist, being compassionate, wanting to live in a society that makes sure everyone has the means to live well, then go Karl Marx!<br /><br />google basic income, it is something advocated by capitalists from milton friedman to thomas paine. it is the only way to have a humane economic system and the only way to result in a society where 100% are wealthy which should be the goal of any economic system.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-67908812848418306262010-07-26T01:23:03.050-05:002010-07-26T01:23:03.050-05:00Hi Matt, how can you expect capitalism to flourish...Hi Matt, how can you expect capitalism to flourish when corporatism always seeks to override it? And I wouldn't lay all the blame on what has happen to the money on the governments doorstep, this was a definite collusion between private and government interests that culminated in the Federal reserve act of 1913. Capitalism , the kind sort of Mom and Pop shops, will never exist again in its pure form because the free market is too easily manipulated. The ultimate expression of capitalism will always end in either a monopoly or a cartel.<br /><br />Even if we reverse some of the damage (i.e. end the Fed, strip corporations of their legal person hood), the moneyed class would find another way to impose their fiat chains on us.Stewnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-87764311503398168662010-07-25T17:18:03.132-05:002010-07-25T17:18:03.132-05:00Yes, of course! Redistribution would fix all of ou...Yes, of course! Redistribution would fix all of our <i>mixed</i> economy's problems! Do tell us about the poverty rates of countries that haven't seen a day of capitalism in their history. I can't wait for this magical communist utopia of 100% wealth.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-1856684688425743502010-07-25T16:20:45.186-05:002010-07-25T16:20:45.186-05:00Capitalism has resulted in 15% poverty, 25% povert...Capitalism has resulted in 15% poverty, 25% poverty rate for blacks, 10% who cant get a job, 93% who will never become wealthy, 50% who will never earn more than $33k which gets u a beat up apartment and beat up car, 45 million without health insurance.<br /><br />I would say capitalism has been a failure. if u use tax to redistribute income, u would make 100% of the population wealthy and fix all the problems of capitalism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-91533624580048325602010-07-25T10:00:44.962-05:002010-07-25T10:00:44.962-05:00If you want to watch a good movie on the monetary ...If you want to watch a good movie on the monetary system watch this video instead: <a href="http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-466210540567002553#" rel="nofollow">Money, Banking, and the Federal Reserve</a>Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8596964566628014410.post-52054960952003602702010-07-25T08:56:04.504-05:002010-07-25T08:56:04.504-05:00To the Zeitgeist cult: Please learn what capitalis...To the Zeitgeist cult: Please learn what capitalism is, the history of it, and where it exists today. Educate yourself on what money is and why the current fiat standard is anti-capitalist. You could start by reading the superb information at <a href="http://mises.org" rel="nofollow">http://mises.org</a>. Then we might be able to have an intelligent discussion about capitalism.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00252455464056599105noreply@blogger.com